Page 276

Page 276




Vote for Off World: The Crease to see the latest incentive page.






  • post comment


  • Anyone may comment, no registration required.

Author--

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
21st Mar 2016, 8:31 AM

There are approximately 100-400 billion stars in our Milky Way and about the same number of other galaxies. So that comes out to between 10 to the 22nd and 10 to the 24th total stars. The estimate for Sun-like stars range from 5% - 20%. Going with the most conservative estimates, that would give us 500 quintillion, or 500 billion billion sun-like stars. There would be at least 100 billion billion Earth-like planets and if even only 1% of those had intelligent life then we would have 10 million billion intelligent civilizations in the universe. In our galaxy alone that would mean at least 100,000 intelligent civilizations, most of which are much older than ours.
Yet we have no proof that they exist despite the sheer numbers. This is known as The Fermi Paradox.

(Edit) (Delete)

Users--

view xpacetrue's profile

xpacetrue
21st Mar 2016, 9:33 AM

What a gorgeous page. And now Liam and party hooks up with Unity. Yay!

Time will tell if Liam can learn to trust her again. But where does his heart belong? He already fell for Liri and we know he's motivated to rescue her. Or will he turn out to be polyamorous?

Bigger question might be how these ghost-like aliens know she betrayed him and know she's now in love with him. Have they been spying on him the entire time? (Or was the love thing exclusively Unity's observation?)

"...Yet we have no proof that they exist despite the sheer numbers. This is known as The Fermi Paradox."

No solid, irrefutable proof, that is. However, there have been not just a few, but many, many sightings of UFOs by -millions- of people. Some close encounters, too. Of course, most of those are relatively recent. But the sightings and circumstantial evidence goes back centuries, even millennia. At which point does doubt give in to the sheer, immense volume of evidence and sightings?

Yes, there are legitimate arguments: "Well, then, why haven't they made formal contact", etc, etc. But, there are also a few rather plausible explanations, such as them obeying some form of Prime Directive or law or something. Or, perhaps world governments have their reasons/agenda for keeping a lid on it (for now).

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
21st Mar 2016, 12:07 PM

The ghost-like alien is a device of the "Ancients" who can move freely through spacetime or more simply described as fourth dimensional beings.
"Being three-dimensional, we are only able to see the world with our eyes in two dimensions. A four-dimensional being would be able to see the world in three dimensions. For example, it would be able to see all six sides of an opaque box simultaneously, and in fact, what is inside the box at the same time, just as we can see the interior of a square on a piece of paper. It would be able to see all points in 3-dimensional space simultaneously, including the inner structure of solid objects and things obscured from our three-dimensional viewpoint. Our brains receive images in the second dimension and use reasoning to help us picture three-dimensional objects." Wiki
They would be all knowing of events in our 3-d world. We can move in x,y, and z while they can move x,y,z, and "n".

The love part was Unity's own observation, or more specific, Essential's. She's a romantic while Crystyn is probably more cynical.

Isn't it funny that an eye witness is considered the best evidence in a court of law but the worst evidence in science?

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view Shan's profile

Shan
21st Mar 2016, 12:12 PM

Eye witnesses really shouldn't be considered the best evidence in a court of law either though as they're frequently, terribly wrong. Probably actually among the worst evidence in law too.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view xpacetrue's profile

xpacetrue
21st Mar 2016, 6:20 PM

" Eye witnesses really shouldn't be considered the best evidence in a court of law either though as they're frequently, terribly wrong... "

You have a good point. However, what if you had many -millions- of witnesses able to give detailed accounts of what they saw and heard? And testimony going back centuries? Nevermind the veracity of eyewitness testimony - the sheer volume is astounding.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
22nd Mar 2016, 11:13 AM

You have to consider the credibility of the witness. In a court of law the witness can be cross examined under oath, and not so much in science.
One of my favorite examples of a credible scientific witness is the story of Debbie Martyr, the head of the Tiger Protection and Conservation Unit in Sumatra. In her 20+ years on the island she has never seen a single Sumatran Tiger but they are not yet classified extinct because of a few native sightings. In that time she has seen Orang Pendek twice but scientists consider them to be extinct.
Orang Pendek, is most likely Homo floresiensis considered to be extinct 12,000 years ago.

So in this case it boils down to, not the credibility of the witness, but how willing the scientific community is to accept it. It's easier to believe in tigers than it is to believe in hominids.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view xpacetrue's profile

xpacetrue
21st Mar 2016, 6:06 PM

I did read where it was explained that it was merely a device they use to communicate. There were two reasons why I referred to them as "ghost-like aliens". One was because they are extra-dimensional beings who we can't see or hear. And it's easier for me to refer to them as ethreal or 'ghost-like'. The other reason was because she/it did not give a name for themselves. We have to call them something, don't we? "Ancients," perhaps?

Speaking of extra-dimensional beings: This might help explain what happened to the 'missing' intelligent life, could it not? Remember what happened to "The Ancients" in Stargate SG1 and Stargate Atlantis? They evolved into beings of pure energy. What if this is the natural order of things: If an intelligence species survives long enough, then there is a strong tendency for them to evolve to such a state? It would help explain why physical beings such as ourselves have such difficulty finding other intelligent life.

It might even help explain UFO sightings. Perhaps they can use devices or otherwise show themselves to us for brief periods, but interacting with us directly could be difficult or impossible? And perhaps they show themselves as a form of encouragement: "See us? We do exist. Now follow after us. Search for us amongst the stars. Evolve and become like us, if you can."

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view Dragonrider's profile

Dragonrider
21st Mar 2016, 10:09 AM

Sir Liam the Virile, Keeper of The Harem, Champion of The Down Trodden, Dufus of Female Relationships, strikes again.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
21st Mar 2016, 12:10 PM

Sir Liam the Naive!

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view Shan's profile

Shan
21st Mar 2016, 12:13 PM

Anyone else thinking Tron with that character in the background?

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
21st Mar 2016, 2:40 PM

Her name is Unity and she is actually two people in one body; Crystyn Weiss from The Demetrius, and Essential, a sentient program.
Her story begins on Page 184.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view Sleel's profile

Sleel
21st Mar 2016, 1:09 PM

i don't really put much weight in the whole older stars then ours part of the argument. Since older stars then our are also metal poor stars, and since they form from the same cloud the star came from, metal poor planets. Such planets aren't going to have the resources to build a civilization capable of leaving a planet. Presuming any life at all can evolve on them that doesn't use said metals and minerals. Those come from earlier generation stars that blow their guts all over the galaxy.
Pretty much everything heavier then a bit of lithium is from dead stars going nova. Think it's lithium. Been a while since I read about that stuff. Basically nothing much but an element or two past helium was made during the Big Band and inflation. Presuming the whole theory is right. So not much is gonna be built with such resource poor planets. So you wont be in contact with them, again, presuming life can even appear in such resource deserts.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
21st Mar 2016, 2:34 PM

Population I, II, and II (Stellar population) is used to describe the meltallicity or content of metal by which generation the star is formed, III being the "first-born" metal-poor stars and Population I the youngest like our sun. It is important to note that none of these generations were formed simultaneously, for instance, some pop 1's are still being formed today. The youngest Population I stars are found toward the center of a galaxy and intermediate Population I stars are farther out. The Sun is considered an intermediate Population I star. Everything outside of us is older, in some cases, hundreds of millions of years older. So as far as stars that could support intelligent life, we are among the youngest stars.
There are many exception scenarios as well:
For instance, this planet had dinosaurs which kept the evolution of mammals in check for millions of years. An identical planet without dinosaurs could be millions of years ahead of us.
Also a smaller planet such as Mars would start to cool sooner and thus start the process of life sooner. Conversely, a larger planet would start later.

What you're saying would be true if all Population I stars were the same age, but they're not.
edit: All Population I stars have approximately the same amount of metal because they were formed from the same generation.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view moizmad's profile

moizmad
21st Mar 2016, 4:17 PM

Let's say there's a technically advanced planet only 500 light years from here, and they started sending out radio waves 300 years ago, we still won't receive them for close to 200 years. The distances are staggering, physical contact is virtually impossible. No human can comprehend even 1 light year.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

Steve O
22nd Mar 2016, 8:12 AM

That assumes we can even pick their signal out of the background noise. Even a terrawatt is small compared to the star the planet is orbiting.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
22nd Mar 2016, 9:58 AM

That's if they are the same age technologically as us. A civilization that is millions of years more advanced than us should have colonized the entire galaxy by now.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

Steve O
22nd Mar 2016, 2:38 PM

There's also the possibility of an intelligent race of marine creatures. Assuming they had technology, it would be totally alien to us since it's hard to make fire under water. But they could have a highly developed civilization.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view moizmad's profile

moizmad
22nd Mar 2016, 3:27 PM

Somehow I doubt any physical colonization would be possible, only some kind of galactic internet authority. Inter-stellar distances are too great. No solid matter could handle even 1% of light speed (that's Chicago to LA in 1 second)

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
22nd Mar 2016, 3:50 PM

You have to take into consideration that they are not hundreds of years or even thousands of years more advanced then us, but millions. Time and space are no longer obstacles to them.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

Coolhand77
23rd Mar 2016, 7:21 AM

Actually, not entirely true. 1% the speed of light isn't "that fast" outside an atmosphere...and IIRC you don't start getting particles turning into hard radiation till you hit around 30%. Project Rho/Atomic Rockets has the numbers on all that, as well as how you work around it...
and as Dizz said, that assumes current technology. More advanced drive methods [or bypassing the problem all together by figuring out hyperdrive or wormholes] may be available to older races...
Of course, theres always the catch...any drive system powerful enough to be interesting, is powerful enough to be a weapon.
Heh, maybe Tunguska was a probe, and like that one Mars shot we flubbed, they pulled a NASA and got their units mixed up on the approach vectors...

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view xpacetrue's profile

xpacetrue
21st Mar 2016, 5:35 PM

I realize that Essential and Tyranos had a rather bitter falling out. However, I can't help but feel that Essential had a love/hate relationship with him. If so, it was likely one-sided. And, granted, they were literally stuck with each other - stuck together. But I thought it seemed like a part of Essential cared about Tyranos. Perhaps it was just to fulfill her purpose - a desire to see him to correct his behavior, to get repaired. But was it, perhaps, a bit more than that (at one time)?

I'm asking because of Unity's observation about Carrencia being in love with Liam. This was Essential's observation. And that makes me question whether she had ever cared about someone like that.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view DizzasterJuice's profile

DizzasterJuice
22nd Mar 2016, 10:32 AM

Essential's personality is best understood by looking at her history. She became sentient within Tyranos more than 100 years ago. In that time she has never been allowed to communicate with anyone else and she has never been in control of her own body. Her basic programming was to care for Tyranos' well being so she has some empathy but no social skills at all.
I tend to think of her as an adolescent youth and their relationship was also immature. In the end, her desire to be on her own was greater than her love for Tyranos. With this flood of new experiences to process she seldom has time to even think of him anymore.

In the next chapter Liam will be asking her some questions about herself.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

view Steven-Vincent's profile

Steven-Vincent
25th Mar 2016, 8:09 PM

Awesome job on the outer space scenes. Those are very hard to do (I know from experience, having cut my teeth trying to do some of these in Blender cycles) and they look gorgeous.

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

StLOrca
3rd Dec 2017, 11:41 PM

Wait—I thought Carrencia was gay? Didn’t she tell Liam she wasn’t attracted to males?

(Edit) (Delete) (Reply)

Web Statistics